Doesn't the LDS Church pass the test with their good fruit (Matthew 7:15-20)?

Jesus said that we will know true prophets from false prophets by their fruit (Matthew 7:15-20). Fruits are actions, but they are more than actions. They are also the beliefs that motivate those actions. Just like a fruit is more than just its skin, so actions are more than their external results. Once you peel the skin of Mormonism away, you see how corrupt it really is. But on the other hand, I don't even think some of the externals of Mormonism would classify as good fruit. Here are some random examples:

1. Baptism for the dead, since it seems the Apostle Paul said that others besides himself and the Corinthian Church do it and since it offers a second chance for salvation after this life (1 Corinthians 15:29-30; Lk. 16:19-31; and Hebrews 9:27).

2. LDS continue to baptize for the Jewish dead after the former promise not to. For more on this, see here.  

3. The quest for worthiness to enter celestial glory and the judgmental-ism that accompanies it.

4. Learning sacred/secret handshakes, names, and passwords in their temple ceremony, so they can get into the celestial kingdom some day.

5. Following along with their temple reenactment of the Garden of Eden, and listening to Lucifer when he tells the patrons to put on their fig leaf aprons. They wear these throughout the ceremony, and are even buried in them. God instead clothed Adam and Eve with skins (Genesis 3:21). Why have anything to do with a continual ceremony that requires the obedience to Satan at any point?

6. The high rates of depression and suicide in Utah, and anti-depressant use in Utah is first among all the states. Even if Mormonism isn't the direct cause, the LDS Church is not providing resources to actually curb this epidemic in a state that is around 60% LDS. For more on this problem, see here, here and here

7. Utah being among the top states in bankruptcy. Again, even if Mormonism isn't the direct cause, the LDS Church is not providing resources to actually curb this epidemic in a state that is around 60% LDS. For more on this problem, see herehere, and here

8. There is no cross anywhere on LDS buildings, but there are plenty of Masonic, satanic symbols.  For more on this, see here and here.

9. There is bending over backwards to limit free speech when we attempt to do outreaches to the LDS Church.  See here for an example.

10. Smith instituted polygamy as divinely sanctioned (God never sanctioned it in the Bible even though He allowed men to act wickedly). Even though the mainline LDS Church disavows practicing this "new and everlasting" covenant today with living spouses, it still has decimated many women's lives (which adds to depression in Utah).

11. The LDS practice of lying for the Lord.

12. There is no praying directly to Jesus, but only to the Father (cf. John 14:14 in Greek or NASB; Acts 7:59; 1 Cor. 1:2; and 1 Jn. 5:13-15).

13. There is racism in many looking down on blacks as not worthy enough to get white skin, since they were not as valiant in the pre-earth life (Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation 1:61-7; and McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 527-8).  There is racism from the LDS First Presidency statement of 1949 claiming that the races were determined by how worthy everyone lived prior to this life, and this was a factor in "the Negroes" not receiving the priesthood prior to 1978.  No apology has ever been issued.

14. There is racist scripture (Book of Mormon passages where God cursed individuals with dark skin and then blessed with white skin when they repented--Alma 3:6-9; 2 Ne. 5:21-4; and 3 Ne. 2:14-6). LDS still by and large think that the mark of Cain was a curse of dark skin.

15. There is an unhealthy pressure on Utah legislators to tow the LDS line.  For more on this, see here.

16. There is sexism in teaching that women are dependent on husbands calling their wives by their sacred/secret names on the day of resurrection in order to go to exaltation in the celestial kingdom.

17. There is working to rule over a world where our own spirit kids will worship us to the exclusion of the God of this world (pride).

18. Divorce is typically at or above the national average in Utah.

19. Divorce is more typical in Mormon families where one of the spouses is removed from membership, since as the Manti, Utah Mormon Miracle pageant says, the exaltation into gods is the most important thing in Mormonism. If this is the case, why waste time with someone who refuses to become a god?

20. Singles are second-class citizens, since the exaltation of married couples is the most important thing in Mormonism.

21. There is no forgiveness for the murderer "in this world, nor in the world to come" (D&C 42:18).

22. There is no forgiveness for more than a one-time offense of adultery (D&C 42:25-29).

23. LDS often communicate with the dead who encourage them in their temple work (cf. Deuteronomy 18:11 with 26:14).

24. There is a common tendency to look down on critical thinking when it comes to religion. Open-mindedness in getting the opposite point of view is discouraged. Recall the infamous LDS statement, "When our leaders speak, the thinking has been done" (Improvement Era [June 1945], 345), and Apostle Boyd K. Packer's statement, "The dangers I speak of come from the gay-lesbian movement, the feminist movement (both of which are relatively new), and the ever-present challenge from the so-called scholars or intellectuals" (Talk to the All-Church Coordinating Council, May 18, 1993). 

25. The preceding problem tends to spill over into other areas of life in which LDS are easily duped.

26. LDS practice unjust adoption practices against the wishes of the non-member father. For more on this, see here, here, here, and here.

27. LDS allow killing an unborn child, not only in the justifiable case of where the life of the mother is seriously endangered, but in the case where the health of the mother is seriously endangered, rape, incest, or where the baby has severe defects that would not allow it to survive after birth. For more on this, see here.

28. LDS vow in their temple ceremony not to have any "light-mindedness [and] loud laughter." See here for yourself at 45 minutes and 16 to about 50 seconds.

29. Utah has been ranked #1 in all the states in online porn subscriptions.

30. The LDS Church keeps kids under 18 years of age from being baptized members in the "only true Church" without parental approval and they keep spouses from being baptized without the other spouse's approval.  Similarly, the Church won't proselytize in certain areas with government restrictions or a lack of Church structure.  Further, the Church won't baptize kids whose parents are polygamists, in same-sex marriage, or apostate behavior.  For more on this, see here.  This all is an example of misplaced priorities, which hinders people from coming to Christ (cf. Matthew 10:34-39 and Luke 18:15-17).

31. The LDS Church "is likely worth $40 billion today and collects as much as $8 billion in tithing each year," however it only gives about .7 percent of its annual income to charity. Contrast that with the United Methodist Church, which has about 5 million less members.  They give about 29 percent (here).

32. "Utah’s statistics are double the national average which gives Utah the horrendous distinction of leading the nation in child abuse cases" (here).

Now even though there are many fine, outstanding Mormon citizens who do a lot of good for others, we should never take this as something that would nullify the rest of their corruption. Mormonism is a corrupt tree with corrupt fruit. This is the result of following a false god, a false Christ, false prophets, and false scriptures. Mormons need to repent of this darkness before it is too late. God is good and powerful enough to give us knowledge now. Today is the day of salvation.

R. M. Sivulka


Add Comment
brian says...
"What's unreasonable about the LDS stance on abortion? Rape and incest are very traumatic things for a woman or girl. If an abortion is performed fairly quickly in such cases (say, within the first 8 weeks of pregnancy) then it is highly doubtful that the embryo or fetus suffers its destruction at any level. Please comment further if you would. Thank you. PS I agree what abortions should not be done for convenience, or late in the pregnancy, except for rare cases in which the mother's life is genuinely in danger, like that East Indian dentist in Ireland who died from severe complications after being denied a medically necessary abortion." (1/5/17)
Rob Sivulka says...
"Just because something is traumatic doesn't entail that one should be kept from doing the right thing. Trauma is relative to the individual. It's quite traumatic for a young girl who was not raped to have to give birth and care for her child. It's also quite traumatic for women to give birth when they don't even realize they were pregnant. These cases don't entail that she should have the right to kill her child whenever she deems it to be too traumatic. There are all sorts of situations in life that we have to go through that are traumatic, but our duty is to still do the right thing. God is still sovereign and He allows us to go through these events so that we will trust Him at each step.

The sanctity of life is always in place. It is absolute.

In the the example you gave, one has to utilize self-defense from dying, but that also is upholding the sanctity of life. The child in this case has become an unintended killer and must be stopped to preserve innocent life. So the sanctity of life affirms that all innocent life needs protection.

The embryo is simply a tiny little human at its first stages of life, and since all humans are persons, as Dr. Suess affirmed, "A person's a person, no matter how small." As such, if the mother wants to give her child up for adoption so that the baby may have a better life than she can provide, there is no faulting her and is actually quite admirable. At least those adopting the baby are extremely thankful." (1/5/17)
brian says...
"Thanks for your reply. There is however, muchdebate as to when personhood begins. An analogy: imagine there's a fire at an IV clinic, and a fireman has the following choice: he can go to wing A and rescue a young adult, or go to wing B and rescue a dozen 10-day-old embryos. Which one should be his priority?

Most people, even most staunchly anti-abortion people, would say the fireman shouldsave the young adult in wing A. The dogmatist can avoid inconsistency by saying,"Why, he should go to wing B instead, since each embryo is equal in value to the young adult!" But, in so stating, they only reveal how untenable their belief is." (1/5/17)
Rob Sivulka says...
"Not sure how your thought experiment justifies the intentional killing of embryos in a rape situation. In that situation, it's not the other one you mentioned that is more analogous, viz., when the life of the mother is at risk. If it was my wife, the decision is easy. I sustain her life and the embryo must die for the reasons I have already stated.

Of course there's debate about anything, and even many Christians disagree with my position here. Nonetheless, the LDS Church, which claims to be the only true Church (D&C 1:30) ought to take the sanctity of life more seriously than having one's relative trauma be the trump card for those circumstances. Of course trauma is real and I don't want to minimize it, but it shouldn't excuse murder (i.e., the taking of innocent life).

And to simply assume that some living human beings aren't persons simply begs the question. They have all the same capacities that every human being has. Without natural defects, those capacities unfold as life progresses and as certain other things happen, those capacities also fold back on themselves (e.g., old age). Nonetheless, the sanctity of life is about human life.
" (1/5/17)
brian says...
"Rick: thanks for this dialogue. A question:haveyou read the book "Letter to a Christian Nation" by Sam Harris? In it, he strongly criticizes people who are opposed to stem-cell research, on the basis that 3-day-old embryos are destroyed. Let me paraphrase him a bit:

"A 3-day-old embryo is a collection of 150 cells called a blastocyst. They have no nerve endings or even neurons, so there is no reasom to believe that they suffer their destruction at all. For the sake of comparison, there are about 100,000 cells in the brain of a fly."

"Perhaps you think the crucial difference lies in the blastocyst's potential to become a human being. However, given recent advances in biotechnology, virtually every cell in one's body has this potential. Every time the President scratches his nose, there has been a holocaust of potential human beings. That is a fact."

"There is no moral reason to oppose stem cell research;we should be pouring vast amounts of money into it right away. Anyone who feels that the 'soul' of a blastocyst just might trump the worth of a child with 3 degree burns on 75 percent of her body, has had their moral sense skewed by religious metaphysics."

Another thought: by the same token, would ut be wrong for a rape victim to take a morning after pill, even though it might destroy a fertilized ovum? I have a female friend who did this." (1/6/17)
Rob Sivulka says...
"I know about Harris' work, but haven't read it. I have his "End of Faith" somewhere.

Those of us who believe the human embryos are tiny human beings are against their destruction. We are not against stem-cell research, since one can do that with adult stem-cells (which have had much better results by the way: https://flfamily.org/life/stem-cell-research-adult-vs-embryonic/) and no beings are killed.

Just because the embryos may not have experiences of suffering is no reason to kill living human beings. One can obviously kill an adult without that adult experiencing any type of suffering. That doesn't justifying killing an adult under those circumstances.

A blastocyst doesn't tell you what type of being it is. There are all different types of blastocysts and thus there are all different types of beings in different stages of developement. You mentioned one being in making an analogy--a fly. A human blastocyst is still a living being in its earliest stages of development, and it may naturally grow up under external care of protection and food to become a toddler, a teen, or an adult. The problem you are having is that you are begging the question that these things "become a human being" rather than seeing that they already are human beings. Scratchings from one's nose may have the potential to become human beings, but tiny human beings don't have the potential to become human beings. They are human beings. And as such, their destruction cheapens human life. You are confusing human parts with human beings." (1/6/17)
brian says...
"Thanks. But, we're back to the question of actuality versus potentiality. A blastocyst may be a potential human due to its genetic material, but that doesn't make it an actual person.

One might ask, "Are 2 blastocysts worth twice as much as an adult human (this is similar to my firefighter/IV clinic analogy). Should a human blastocyst be consideted more important than a herd of elephants?

Moreover, human sperm and ovums also have the potential to become human beings. Thus, is contraception (birth control) wrong in all or most cases?" (1/7/17)
Rob Sivulka says...
"Well I don't see the blastocyst in the same category as a human part like a human sperm or a human egg. It's genetically something new with new DNA different from either parent. It is full of capacities that unfold naturally. This is what we mean when we talk of a human being, so it seems reasonable to take it as the start of a human being rather than a potential to become one like a sperm or egg. And since they are human beings, they are certainly much more important than other beings, including elephants, since the former are made in the image of God and deserve that sanctity of life. " (1/7/17)